Otter Voice Meeting Notes

0:43

Hey Elliot.

0:45

Hi Jim how's it going good.

0:49

So, so I see you says otter AI is live.

0:56

Yeah, so I can view this even. Right. Did you, did you see how to use that if you go to that live notes and you click on the View stream.

1:07

Yep, I see it now.

1:12

I interesting. Yeah, you can see what you're saying.

1:16

That is really cool.

1:23

Yeah, it seems to be pretty good they were complaints that it was inaccurate.

1:31

Yeah. I wonder how it does when the discussion is more technical.

1:38

Yeah, that might be the issue. Yeah, I

1:44

wonder if there's ways that we could deal with

1:49

it. Shane, just the technical words or something. Yeah,

1:55

I saw that I'm assuming you guys are talking about the captioning. Yeah, I saw I think on slack on maybe the one of the boards, something about that, there's maybe a way to like upload a technical dictionary, but it would be like a trial thing or something like that may not work, but it may improve things for the future or something like that.

2:25

But I kind of feel like the Snowmass cross I mean there's got to be some funds available from somewhere right and this is something that's important.

2:39

I agree I think that the conveners are looking into it.

2:46

But I'm not I have to admit I have not personally followed the details.

2:51

Even though I agree that it's something we we should do.

3:01

Yeah.

3:02

One thing I noticed with the otter AI is it doesn't tell you who's speaking.

3:07

Oh really.

3:09

Right. And, in fact, when you came in I interrupted Elliot, and then that sort of. It was transcribing what he had been saying. And as I spoke over him, apologies for that Elliot, it, it was confused.

3:25

And that's really not surprisingly, I see Oh, so I have to open a separate window to see the note.

3:36

Yes I clicked on it. Yeah, that's kind of annoying.

3:42

Yeah, you would think you could fit it into this, but I guess, right, although maybe there's a way. So, I just got an email, sorry, I just got a note that there's people in the other room.

3:54

There's people in the room which are in the original room so they must have looked at the original email and not that so let me go there and make sure people. Yeah, I will hurt everyone over here. Okay, okay. Thank you,

4:13

saying, Hey, how are you, this get out.

4:19

I tell how is there everybody at home.

4:23

Good. Thankfully, So, yeah, we've been.

4:30

We've been keeping to ourselves, but, you know, it Tamron is this at the hospital. And so, that's worrisome but so far.

4:44

It's good.

4:45

Yeah.

4:46

We couldn't couldn't travel to bed with Miss aspect to write.

4:51

I know it's like so weird to be in Michigan at home for the summer.

5:00

I'm in town. Yes. Something about what yeah you'll go ahead and give a talk.

5:09

No, not me of me but but my, my comment was the following. I was supposed to be in Beijing in July, but you did everything you could to avoid that.

5:22

Because all ticket Antonia. I don't, I don't think I did anything but the US, certainly is not a very welcome people from us worldwide it won't be well. Well if you prefer I can use my other my other passport Spanish passport would it be better.

5:38

I don't think so I think they are the current in pretty much everybody outside, they think they have done the best.

5:45

Very decontrol very tightly so everybody will have to be 14 days quarantine. I don't want I don't think you want to go there as well and don't say anything I know you're unable to say something No, I was just curious, you still explain. No, I've never been, I left the Spain when I showed you and I haven't been back to Spain. He's so nice in Spain.

6:07

Last Carlos What do you say Carlos. Your soul is in Spain. I have I suppose in Spain. Oh, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. But, no, I was with this vendor they before everything exploded, we discussed it last time at the PSM in Madrid so I think it has something to do with me and his well being together.

6:30

It's a curse.

6:32

It's a curse. Okay, Tom, thank you. Thank you very much.

6:36

But who is who is Baltimore and who is Harry Potter, we have to polish venom myself, so bold, who's Harry Potter.

6:50

We know who's out there morning, I think machine could play her morning.

6:55

Okay.

6:58

The smartest of the lot i mean Kimmy. Oh, there we go.

7:08

What is that.

7:10

Well, that was right at home.

7:18

I think we're all at home but who's playing music.

7:28

You can you can mute whoever you want machine you know the thickets that bear behind Carlos.

7:35

Oh yeah.

7:43

Yeah, used to be in a room of some of the kids, almost say last year and I don't know what that bear.

7:52

But when you're not on stairs. I am upstairs. Yeah.

7:59

I said I have to do another talk downstairs. And there have been there has been no classes, you know, different days, the most powerful one pick the best, and then kind of fix the second

8:15

day, the family that seems to get mad. Now I think has to be in my office forever, when I was teaching so I'm used to it.

8:26

Carlos, you are lucky that the Lego logo is overcrowded so you have a large audience today.

8:34

Why, then, there was a talk today, going now about about these new gravitational waves.

8:44

But there's an upper limit of.

8:49

Well, don't let didn't let me.

8:53

Maybe lead you in. Oh my god.

8:56

I'm sorry I have to listen to your talk.

9:01

It's fam. You don't have to listen to you. You just put yourself you mute yourself and you keep on working.

9:08

Just pretend. Yes, your bread then you listen to my talk, and then we are happy.

9:18

Okay, so I don't know if you've managed. So Jim Are you back.

9:24

So we're still, so we were so there was a confusion about the zoom rooms, there was a previous link for this.

9:32

In the previous email, and then we had.

9:37

It looks okay now but I will log back in there with my, I don't know why I either I made me stay because the first place I went was at Fermilab was his room. And then I look in your email gene, and he was a CERN one so clearly. The original link from last week had a was the Fermilab a zoom but we changed to CERN for technical reasons so. Okay then, then, then I didn't make a mistake.

10:02

Yeah, that's a reminder thing we sent off that link, and we'll, we will record that. Okay, so I'm gonna go ahead and start in is Elliot, the host, right. I think so but he No, I think you are the host Jim joined first.

10:25

I'm certainly not the host rejoin us from my CERN. That's probably what needs to happen. Yeah. Okay, it looks like people can share screens though.

10:36

Okay. But yeah, in order to control the mute and things like that I have to be yeah that'd be better. Yeah, but at least we can we can share so alright so we'll wait for Elliot to log back in and I guess Elliott is doing the slides, I think, or, or maybe Carlos. Oh yeah, we can get why don't I

11:02

change the default so that I don't know how to do that, like I guess the host does it that people when they join in, they muted automatically.

11:10

So I think that's one of the issues we're having right now. Yes.

11:18

Okay, so I'm back and I think I now have posted powers. Yes, I saw that you do good. So I can now

11:27

you all.

11:33

And I can unmute you Jim and we can get started and I'll start the recordings.

11:40

Do you want me to go through the slides. But your unused unmuted. Do you have that power, or are you unmuted yourself so okay yes i unmuted myself yeah do you want me to go through the slides or did you want to. I thought you were going to say okay that's fine. Yeah.

11:56

Okay.

12:05

Okay.

12:11

Can you see them now.

12:16

Yes. Okay, I won't try to make them fullscreen I'll just go ahead so just a few, a little bit of news for our group meeting today so on the second slide the energy frontier workshop will be held July 20 through the 22nd, this will be three half days. You can see the link right here.

12:38

To prepare for So as usual and we want to make sure to have plenty of time for discussion and large group discussion as much as possible. Since this is an early meeting in this process. So to prepare for the workshop, we are planning a, an all bsm joint session so this will be this group model specific, the more general bsm search group fo nine f 10 is the dark matter at colliders group fo seven is heavy ions with some VSM component, and then also the Higgs bsm. So we're having a joint session. The afternoon us afternoon of July 7 on open questions and new ideas. So we encourage you to submit an abstract for a 10 minute talk or an offline flash talk, and there's more details on what that means, at this link here, and the deadline for that is by June 28 so at the end of this week.

13:47

And so please submit your abstract. If you've.

13:54

I would say be as inclusive as you'd like just go ahead and submit. Even if you've already given a talk or if you've already expressed interest in in a different way. It'll only take a few moments, and.

14:05

And that would be very helpful for us for the planning. So thank you for the Monte Carlo taskforce This is the same slide as before. Please fill in the survey, as your ideas of what you might need become more concrete here's the survey here, this is useful for planning the production.

14:24

Feel free to talk to us offline to ask about what's reasonable to request and what other requests look like. And then this document here shows the evolving information on the existing samples so you can see what already exists as you decide what you might need.

14:44

Slide four so this is again, as usual for input to us.

14:49

If you'd like to submit topics for bi weekly meetings, there's a link here, these are very very short, take you two minutes to fill these out and it's you can put in a lot of free text and it gets automatically loaded to a Google spreadsheet that's very useful for us. And then, please express your informal interest with no cut no commitment to what you'd like to study at the second link for the, for the Snowmass process we've already had a lot of great input. But we, we hope to have more on, you can tell us anything what models you're interested regions of parameter space different colliders scenarios or detectors. And thanks to everyone who has already submitted. Finally, so for the next few meetings today we're talking about Susy VISTA will not be the last time we will talk about Susie's we'll have an overview from Carlos, some talk on PMS ma studies from Sam, and then the ILC perspective from the Kyle. I'll tell you, Ben about these threads.

15:51

I'll tell you about those in a minute. July 7 we'll have our workshop there the joint session in the afternoon, which we're planning now.

16:01

July 21 is the workshop. And so then our next regular biweekly meeting will be August sex the topic has not been determined yet, so please feel free to suggest that through the Google Form.

16:13

Not now Shane I really liked this idea, and despit since it was yours, do you want to tell us about the, the pen discussion threads on the Snowmass Slack, or sure that people will use this Oh, and I'm also hoping that most of the people who are attending the meeting right now are actually signed up for the slack. If you have not, I would highly recommend that you do that.

16:41

So that I did. So what we wanted to recreate or try to as much as possible is the experience that you have at a at a workshop right i mean it's not just going in listening to talks, the most useful part to me usually is the casual discussion with people right i mean the coffee time where you talk physics, but it's not the formal thing that you that we usually have it now in the meetings like you know you'd raise your hand and you say stuff. So, and what I found personally is that the zoom chat is very disorienting to me and disorganized and I have a hard time, addressing things to specific people or specific comments. So what I figured, is a good use for the slack I mean the whole point of having the snowman slack was to have community engagement. So, what I thought might be a good idea is that we have synchronous as well as asynchronous discussion on these threads on our channel for the, for each talk. So, I.

17:52

So Jim you were trying to did it not open the thread the link or what happened. Ah, sorry I forgot I was sharing.

18:00

Yeah I I'm exploring to see how this works. So, I haven't succeeded yet. Well, my hope was the link. The link. Just to the page that we are just seeing, not to any section.

18:17

I first when I first clicked the link, it did take me to a slack. It took me to slack.

18:23

But then what, and then what I see there is the link to the talk, but I have to see how to comment.

18:34

Maybe I can see that the only thing in the thread right now is a link to the talk. Okay, so, is that what's causing confusion. You can kind of hover over the post, there's this sort of speech bubble start a thread. And then if you're the first one to want to say something, then a thread is created and everybody can respond to another. Maybe I put maybe I should put a. Oh, somebody did under your ply. Beautiful. Yes, thank you. Starting threads so now you know you can reply to these threads, and you can address specific people by typing at okay so when you start typing at, then it brings up you know all the people and you can say act machine right and that would be responding to my comment. So I thought that might be a good way of getting discussion about various things about you know the specific talks that we're having, but also, you know, as a continuing discussion about these topics.

19:39

You know, which is the whole process of Snowmass right and I encourage you, apart from just these threads that right now I've pinned for our particular talks today. I would encourage you to start threads that are of interest to you right i mean because people can come and

19:57

interact with that at their leisure whenever right those things are there.

20:02

So I really hope that people will make use of this, and, you know, again, it. We should be trying to optimize the situation we find ourselves and, and let's see how well this works, and if anybody has any other ideas, they're most welcome. Please, please, you know, let us know.

20:25

Thanks for sharing.

20:28

Okay, I think that's all for the intro then. So, I will stop sharing and Carlos, would you like to share our first talk is Carlos will give us an overview and introduction on Susy.

20:51

Okay.

20:53

Let me share.

20:58

Can you see my screen. Yes.

21:02

Okay. A very good Nami, can you color bubble on the lower right corner bubble in the lower right I don't see it. Well, we're in, Carlos you're showing us the color palette that you use for all Sunny Sunny, very good. So let me close it so they're nice just stop sharing.

21:31

Now you close it. Now you close it and you didn't So, and also you are not h o for neutralino is really horrible.

21:41

I did justice, upset you. That me, did I close a cup No No he's not close your stop sharing everything. I know, I know, I know that's a stub Shin dig we kind of help you know if you close something or not because we cannot see what you're doing right now I will do it.

22:06

Can you see that now. Yes, now do play do play.

22:12

Yes. Up here.

22:16

Oh my notation from the diocese perfect Okay, very horrible so then when I was asked. I was stuck with Anthony. So then, let's talk about the I will talk about a little bit about supersymmetry and the connection with Alexey.

22:34

Obviously, I have to talk about this in 20 minutes so I will be brief overview of some important topics or what I consider to be important topics on the subject.

22:48

Okay, I will see how it goes. So then, as you know, then a su C class important consequences. One of the most important consequences is the fact that the given at a recent rating scale of about one TV you can address the issue of traditional religion, namely why defective x mass is negative, and passive scalar because under the question of dark matter of course, that it is intrinsic to mothers who survived the conservation, that the analogous thing myself, the only way of course a lot of excitement. Back in the early 90s was the issue of unification again unification will not be part of the main issues that we're discussing spoken, or considered.

23:42

So let me talk a little bit about this person with the spectrum and they certainly are pressures. Come along.

23:50

And they certainly are pressure is based mostly on pronunciation to branding, or the mass parameters, we know that if we are very heavy Gleaners those heavy rains tend to push all the score masses up. So therefore color particles tend to be heavy.

24:08

The third generation supersymmetry masses, receive a large number of corrections in the organization rebranding bled into the last topic or Caplin and tend to be the lightest and that the place and Patanjali phenomenology if obviously if all come from similar boundary conditions. The message of scale, and a detour into ethics, of course, the stops play an important role. But let me remind you a little bit of these topics, just quoting what is the typical evolution of the parameters. So, if you start with the universal parameters or the high scale. And then what happens when I got here image one and image two are simply the mass of the saucer percent of the masses for the, what we now call typically HDX and each of the kicks that happens to them and quarks and the big difference between the running of this is this effect or the time that time is associated precisely with, you got to correct things. And you see what happens. So then if you start with a nerve cell masses, the masses of electrons quarks then received this last correction that is proportional to what happened what happens in association a mass with a large collection factor. And the thing with them you, and you have to remember that the glue animosity 2.5 and a half. So then, so essentially all the golden part of the solution by de facto, but the, there is the effect or emceed or that the universal skin mass, and the only factor that I am that is proportional to your copies, is a bound by the ratio of the square with respect to what is called the fixed one by fixed one value is the value that you should cover no energy so that the capital blows up or the notification scale in this case. And they these are equations that assume the gods came to be the messenger of scale the scale at which supersede the parameters of unity.

26:18

And I don't want to you to pay too much attention to the whole formula for Latin square but just two terms, the first term is a, the one proportional to three Caf YT or we did y to y f as I said is a ratio of the ownership you can tap into the pension pension beta for low tide should be can go up to value so for one, but for a mother, a large balance of tension beat that that ratio is about two thirds.

26:47

And then you'll see that to certain city staff is one. And then when you set that to the, to the equation for the, for MH two. So you'll see that the dependence and MC disappears. That is the famous focus point property. That means that the low energy mass is supersonic in mass for for the array one mass parameter that the events the supersymmetry, they increase material Akin, as is shown in the, in the equation for tension beta. So then it becomes independent who Cyril so that means that you can push him to to lash values you bring all the scalar mass production values. But however they fix mass remain small, so that means to fulfill the symmetry, you can keep new, more valuable so so becomes somewhat not too bad. Now, what I also want to you to pay attention to is the last time, and the Time Square proportional to one half square. And then you'll see that there is a large coefficient multiplied by n squared, that means that even if you have insensitive directly to MC zero, then you still have a lot of sensitivity or effort to you know mass control by and so therefore a. So the simple solution that the, that is the focus point solution, of course, is not the solution to see, to make things natural, but, but if you now start with ourselves some sort of non universality, where a that happens due to supersymmetry and perhaps the boundary condition for image to is larger than the boundary condition for for the square masses, you can get still values of the fixed masses that are small, making things a little natural and again, there is a different concept between fine tuning the new parameter to cancer damage to or things that come from supersymmetry that we cannot control. And that's why many, many groups, play with this idea of supersymmetry Nanos so supersymmetry the mass parameters, run in a quite a different form, so that they I parameterize here by different coefficients, but the only thing that I want to stress is that those coefficients depend, not on depend on the supersymmetry against the messenger scale.

29:14

The scale at which supersymmetry is transferred to the mass parameters. I hear I just, Lisa, a few words. Oh no, so much parameters, but there are plenty. And they what they show in that plot is simply correlations, what do you need to be the correlation between different so the sum of the masses MC zero, will be the masses of the squares and image the mass of the fixes, as a function as a messenger scale. In order to get back, low values of the some of the stuff masters one or two masters at least six months. And you'll see that the, the correlation. The least values are, that are further one but not necessarily one. So, and that will ensure, nobody uses supercritical flow unnecessarily so so not sitting so, one could consider this some sort of fine tuning but, again, this is some correlation that could be establishing supersymmetry. Okay. And I think that all issues of naturalness will pass in an obsession. So those contour plots, by the way, are the ratio of the lunar mass to the, to the recommended stop mass, then and you'll see again you get by yourself, or more so.

30:29

Now, as you'll see in the logo fam. I vary the messenger scale from last value so far like 10 to 16 Chevy two batteries are for identify Chevy. So that means that there is a dependence on the supersymmetry scale that is quite strong actually.

30:47

But that reminds me, the fact that the low innocence facility again class is an important issue. And these two feministic properties that are different from the ones that they usually test, mainly due to the fact that the gravity now becomes the lightest supersymmetry part, but tends to be tendinitis.

31:09

And this is due to the fact that they supersymmetry you can scale the muscles, I suppose, or the, the standard superpartner standard mo superpowers governed by the ratio of the order parameter for supersymmetry in this f 10 divided by the messenger scale that as I said can be vary by the gravity no mass is the same ratio of F where the plant scale so if you, if you have the messenger scale to be much smaller than the landscape you also have the gravity you know mass to be much smaller than the supersymmetry masses. And once you have that. So the light this tunnel superpartner tends to attend to everything on a standalone particle, the interactions with via the Goldstein are components. So they are for the 10s on one over F, and have the we have the captain's, a, and a, you see what happens that the, the lifetime of the standard superpartner for a study like this. Electricity No.

32:09

Can the gain to a photon and Ira, do you know, in a way that the with a with that you can see from the formula here. And what this important that goes. So this place where this is that the can. so if f is sufficiently small can be visible at the colliders. So in most of the cases M is about 10 to he. So then, certainly the lightest animal superpartner still behaves at the collider level, at least, like if it were a stable. But, if f is sufficiently small, so that could lead to this play for ethics and a different terminology that I will mostly not discuss in this talk, but I think is an exciting possibility that the that the faster we explore the theoretical universe experiment.

33:00

So then, regarding the bounds on those tanomo Super particles, and one is, we should start with ugliness ugliness, of course, or color particle psychopath producer delete see, they became more free to ask or can acquire state, and a and again they will mostly came to on to the lightest of the squares does tend to has a stop. So therefore, it's important to analyze a case into two partners.

33:30

And obviously that lead to two states with, for instance, two tops and we synergy that is an important channel that one has to explore. Okay, so who knows. And of course as you know the light reading if it is stable collider level, at least we need to miss it.

33:46

So we're very interesting when a few years ago. So when Atlas. Look for the guru he knows the gain into two pairs of tops and missing energy. They saw an excess that they represent the, the, I mean for 13 days 36 investment. And you'll see that the in the blog below, because you see that the bond becomes weaker than expected bound that says was pointed towards lunar muscle to TV. And then altaria Moscow be light. Now, as you know what's happened so that he sees that this Saturday, we'll check on what happened in a more recent publication is that access disappeared was just so that the most important message is that within the economic kinematically allowed region. So you can put around and the good enormous adventure from about 1.5 Db to 2.2 db. And they, this is body provided the donor candidate direct into such a nation's works. So for instance to pay us and readiness, services, this is a very strong bound, of course, a, you can imagine that if you have agree no such mass can again turn into turn attorney nobody can begin to vote on Turkey, you know, Kentucky, and the church you know can cascade again to either light and readiness. This of course has been a study that they see. And in that case you can weaken the bounce but not tremendously. I mean, provided the light that neutrino mass is below one TV, the bounce didn't become very strong for the 1.5 to two TV. Now observe that in this plot, showing this yellow line that yellow line applies to the case where there is a really like gravity No, that can appear could either Sunday to finance day who photons punishments are set and we see Nancy, and the bounce tend to be a stronger case that in the case that that you have just missing energy.

35:48

Not always, but but you see the pattern.

35:53

So anyway, so that so therefore, we expect the, we are convinced, more or less, to to experiment data says that the most likely the guru, you know, should be heavier than one TV and probably to do.

36:07

So, the guy there's two masses in there is some theoretical guy that's contrary to you know and they said their guidance come from the competition or the Higgs mass. You know the kicks last say depends on drive the corrections, and they want to blend into it, we can in the stock masses and depends strongly on these parameter x t that they that they show here that these a stop mixing parameter governed by a T minus mu that is you know when I draw attention data. And the important thing is that depends quadratic can inquire typically on these on these topics in parameter and ultimately the overall scale of the stock masses. So now you can add the two corrections that do corrections tend to moderate, how do you deal with the corrections to, so make the stop masses heavier, Mr masses larger sorry for the case for the Higgs mass. And long story short, there will have been many, many words on this direction. So the conclusion is that in order to get the right Higgs mass. so you need either a body or surface of the brain component that makes him break in parameters that are maximal and stop massive so for one TV or Russia, or a, if you go to lower body so the body parameter XT unit, even heavier stops, so that means within them SSM, then a, in order to be consistent with the financial properties that we have set up with Mr Massey that are about one to three or more for sure.

37:42

So, and this is this. This is important because you have to be compared with the person stop searches. I hear I put stop searches in the case of direct decay to tops. And you'll see what happens the present stop searches, even for Lionel already knows where we are very solid, so they go up to values of 1.2 TV, they start to explore the ration of parent or stop masses that you need to be consistent with the Higgs mass, but they don't go beyond that. So that means that to really explore will this, we will need the model luminosity or heavier energies Lucha Genesis. On the other hand, there is this compression where the stop mass is close to the top mass plus notre mass, and therefore they are the bounce can become even weaker so then oversee kindness and kindness you. So, and therefore a still open this possibility that the final tally now for that so you can see we are stopped for a certain time to AWS, so you can see, then the, this is still open you to do this properly. However, even as I said, if you assume that the boundary one three. So then it's just a deletion of parameters that you need to be consistent with fix.

39:04

So then, on the other hand, this is just the direct decay or stopping to top neutrinos, you can have either the case when it's time beach or, you know, Cascadia case in similar to a lunar case. And they, and you'll see here I present two plots from CMS and Atlas, where essentially the, the conditions that they have chosen for the Cascadia case are such that you have a large PT so you never go to to comprehension mostly, either because you have a cascade to a very like really no or you assume that she knows they are that they stop and adrenal masses. And again, here you can we can sign with the bounds, that you said about you can we can even eat more. If you go to some complications if you relax condition parameters so that means that the stop bounds are certainly not as strong as the greener ones. And they depend a lot on what are the Cascadia case and what these original parameters and I think that will be reflecting the pm and MSM studies, right.

40:11

So then, now going to set that guy down so we can take from the Higgs sector not on the Higgs mass of the Higgs captains and the here, you, you see this amazing LSU innocence here a person that represents, where they measure the couplings to the gauge bosons and to Association quarks and leptons, and nothing differs by more than 20% from the Standard Model observations. So that means that the Higgs is really a very standard one like.

40:42

So then. Now, in, in them SSM Of course we have to doublets, and therefore you expect some deviation. So the companies will rapid to, to the Standard Oil couplings, those are parameters here but this parameter Kappa Kappa V and Kappa V, and you'll see the appearance of two values, one sine beta minus alpha. And in that contrast, copy, and the other deviations are the proportion to tension between cause and determine.

41:13

So when you go to less than Chibita you expect collaboration so who worked on capital hoping to extend the model, unless you go to cosine beta and alpha very small, that this, what is called the condition for line. Now, cosine beta means certify equal to zero close to zero can be obtained in two ways. One is by a certain combination of equality couplings that the the least two cancellation of the mixing, or the light and heavy fixes in the fixed basis, or by the coupling all the, all the particles and you end up with an effective theory, it's just a standard.

41:49

I would concentrate mostly the first possibility because it's the most interesting one, where you can still have like particles.

41:57

Now, if you study what happens in them SSM, what happens is that the cosign button or self attention beater so that parameter deviation. So the captain of the bottom corner will refer to a sternum or they have an expression that the Ico ban by the first two terms that are essentially in tension between the pendant so they're. Therefore, the penalty on the, on the muscle the heavy fix. So this shaft reflects the process of the coupling. When the heavy Higgs MH capital is large, then you have that this deviation becomes small. Now there is a second time that on is only important when you go to very large very substantial beta unless you suffer at a meal. And, and can lead to a process of alignment and SSM but but only now not original parameters were attention beat I somewhat laughs and at me are very large but they will present you what happens for most of what happens if you study aviation so the cabling or the cross section would refer to the standard one, you will see that there will be a buy more than 10% if you go to value so the Higgs mass is below 500 cV, and therefore start to be intention with precision measurements.

43:12

And that is what happened so so essentially it today is really small or at times really small so the second part the proportion should be a substance, you can put a bound on the in the MSM on the fixed one schefren composition measures on the axis or for the second issue. And that can be circumvented Of course, and this is upload. So you see the name, the upload the how the branching ratio for fixed changes. If you have small values of Neo, then you will be able to put a bound on on ma that is simply simply independent 10 should be just about on me. But if you start to put a lot of money on it suddenly you, you can ameliorate this behavior and you can go to lower value so for me.

44:03

Now of course you can know what not, do whatever you want because as soon as you put less than Schumpeter you started to come from direct bounce that come from direct production of the heavy fixes, and that the who are showing here, so when you go to that study center it should be that you completed the KCC in association who was on board, who are doing afflictions, you know fission. and this production is done should be squaring hands. So therefore, you can look for the Higgs is mostly the game to Tao leptons that the, that also have attention tokens coupling and branching ratio tends to be a further 10 points or 10%, unless they have supersymmetry particles that are lighter than the than the heavy fixes that this to expect in these cases. So then, here I show you, for instance, this case where there's like electro leakiness. And you'll see that this is like an intravenous flow meal, so therefore alignment is not working. And you'll see these dashed line outs you kind of see that comes just from Precision measurement so so that boundary sharpness issue, precision measurement. So they're these ones that were present in that plot in the yellow in the blue band, have been now updated. But, but again, you'll see that the. Essentially what they are doing now is leaving open all the duration of time should be below 10, but the four values have to be 10 or larger, so you need to hear for one thing.

45:33

So therefore a. So, is there any fixes or below about them. So there is a lot of room open. But of course, you have the problem with precision measurements because the tension beat below 10. So then you could you don't have enough in the in the MSM to align the fixes. So there is certain complementarity between the two things, then between the precision measurements and under excerpts.

46:00

Now, things change if you are in SSM, and they change for two reasons. Then, one is because the stops, can be lighter, due to a fight, there are corrections to the Higgs mass that chemistry level proportional to the captain lander was a singlet with K six square, and also more important for for the process of alignment. There are corrections to the mixing in the Higgs bases that are proportional to the square. And it turns out that the lambda squared so for that point 65, you can get the good kicks winnaman otoshi. Then, without going to any luxuries of a do meal or luxurious attention meter for instance, in this plot I show you below, what is a variation has a coupling of the, of the dank wax, you have like the standard model for values of lambda for the point 65, that in the panel above you see this blue bond in the panel above on the left are the values of lambda that you need for alignment, and are about point 65, but you see that point 6570. They're mixing become very small for all values of tension between thought and the thought of their body for what, for which they fix bounce the from the neck surgery become weak.

47:16

And the other thing that happens is that the stops for more than a mixin can be a further one TV so then so can be larger. But for retention data for the two to three can be a further one TV, getting the right six masses so you'll need the Sacramento labs correction that therefore this motivates the continuous set of stops until its end.

47:40

Now the other important thing that happens at the lineman he's at the heavy fixes so when you, when you kill the mixing between the heavy kicks and the like kicks in the fixed variances. You also kill the devil fix decay of the heavy kicks. They say because you can imagine that you have the devil kicks okay and we put our reputation value for the Higgs you generate that mix. And that is seen, if you go scan. So then you see that you are close to alignment for values of lambda close to alignment, you you suppress very much the Higgs to hh, these are very consistent with mineralogy. So, to Valencia ratios are small, or for a few percent. Our the single advocates are not constrained. And you can have a much larger tension ratios into singlets, or into mixed states where you have a standard when life kicks and a single state that can become light. So, and I believe that this Higgs phenomenology essentially in models like the NMR system, and motivate the search okay he exists in this case in the cases in astronomer Higgs, and on standards. So then, so I think that that is another sector, that the deserves to be explored in these kind of models.

48:57

And then, this has been done for instance of CMS, they have explored the case into gauge persons and arbitrary value software no standard exists for both CPN and CPL cases. But the way we are proposing is to do a similar search into Hicks's instead of shotgun ocean suffixes. I know that it's more challenging but I think these will not.

49:21

Now, finally, I want to talk about the electric sector. The situation is far less constraining the electric sector but also presents opportunity for the discoveries. And also, every sector is very important because who are the data masteries and we're maybe the corrections to G minor student side instruments to test we really anomalous. So then, now styles are an important set, and also can participate for instantiation of our motto by quantization with a, with an ultra Leno's, but the bounce on stuff today very weak. For ether represented in this plot in the right panel, you see that the bounce and the styles are essentially a further 400 cV, but only as an ultra Leno's are lighter than 100 cV, and also assuming that all the styles of right and left are at the same mass. So, in order to maximize the cross section that you can have, and in addition you assume that this sounds like a direct into tonal rellenos. So having large 80 of the tower so so and there is large gaps of course, if you are far away from the compression. So it's clear that the styles are still pretty unconstrained, and the cell to be explored for.

50:40

Now the other sector that is important is Chelsea Arsenal readiness. So, I'm the that will be the emphasis in the last minutes of my talk, that I don't know how many. So, so I have a few, so not five minutes of my talk, I will concentrate on this. So then as you know the masses are controlled by the by the beaner we know masses and they fix enormous parameters. So, but they you know they go to their adrenal Maxwell nerve center for instance in this close by Atlas. And here I am combining, there were several searches. So, for instance, you have to charge in a no brainer searches that are very important that they represent in the vanilla web that they cherish you know, can they gain to WNS enlightenment really no, and the second light they don't really, you know, Said. Can they gain to set an age, and the notary, and the notary No. And they, sorry, And the important thing here is that two things have been assuming these plots. First, they are different the case for instance a blue includes case the case, the yellow include South African said that right up to the case that we so find ourselves in know how we were so long ago. And then, and I think that the old these are quite important upset that they fix a club, further reaching in the, in the church you know masses but that they don't go so far in the no trader method. Now, two caveats. This these bounds, have been obtained, assuming we're winners, and also branching ratios of these aka that present a further one. So, and the branching ratios tend to be point five for each time to set an age, so that we relax the bounds, and the and the editor, do not necessarily add an unnecessary witness. So then, so for me.

52:35

I'm seen on the previous bound on the charging oh one, the one that you show ww charge you know plastered you know my news via WW.

52:48

That never exist in the, in the analysis they do because they assume that the charging is isolated.

52:56

There are no neutral estates around. So, that bound to me is meaningless. Because, in a situation when they are neutral enough around. Then try leptons we beat you, and you see the situation when they when they charge you know sort of the lightest estate, the neutral he knows also influences found. So, it is a very important point.

53:21

Antonia. So then observe that the, what do you are saying, indeed, realize in the fact that the second point you made the yellow bound is much stronger than the than the Green Mile so there's so this rule of thumb bounds realistic or not play a secondary role in this compared to Thailand. Not always. Not in this blog sorry in this in this summary block. There can be cases where the electron gives you the stronger bounds. But he's not in the situation of that in these particular papers, analyze, he has intuition is also populated by neutralino if you came to char gene on gravity, you know, things like that. Okay, so, I agree. But let me, let me because there will be many talks I guess exploring some. Let me, let me stick to a simpler thing because we don't have much time. But but this is a representation of of this bounce under these assumptions, and what the only thing I want to say in addition to what you're saying is, is the data been obtained with certain assumptions that are not necessarily the ones that we find.

54:32

And also I want to stress the fact that there is another channel for no production that does not come from direct production we engage persons that come from Hicks the case that be related to something I mentioned before.

54:47

First of all, the fact that we not have logical sections and kicks in here put heavier, heavy super heavy squats, so ignore any score corrections, and you'll see that indeed the winners cover a cross section that tends to be a factor for larger than the than the center corrections, and also the cross sections are sizable so they can be before the dance on 100% allowance. So then, so that is important. Then and can become a further pickle on if you go to too low masses on that account the philosophic says, if we restrict ourselves to secrecy we are more again play a role. then a, and they play an important role to cover the compressed vision as if, if you are a low very substantial beta reader in interface you know the case.

55:41

They can make a motion to set an ultra Lino on kicks and ultra Lino. And as I said if you go to sufficiently large second leg readiness differential ratios tend to be for the point five due to the, to the cost and again and then, and that is what is unimportant.

56:03

Okay, I want to stress two things. Imagine that you have heavy windows now and you put realistic the case in the making. So now you use a cross section by a factor of a few because of. First, the fact that they are not witness, and they have the cross section is smaller and second you put relative action ratios that the more than a the case. So then, then the rich African machinery is is weak. So then as you see here. Then there are large gaps and the mostly dominated by the, the trailer conservatism.

56:38

As you would expect.

56:40

So, but the, but you know they even if you go to Cerritos event from Taiwan you have shocking senior who knows. So the rich as a recasting the winner Socrates, put in realistic resection so and so is still large, but, but it's comparable to what he presented today for the winners, we full luminosity right so it's weaker. But the covers are very important and interesting vision parameter space. So even in the fixing of gains that will be the most conservative case. Now you'll see that there is a gap in the compressed region that is difficult to cover. But more important than that, let me, let me present the following that if you just recast the press and bounds on the scenes, you can see novena scenario. They are really lousy the cover, a small region of perimeter space, and you compare that with the discovery which are 3,000% on become much stronger so there is a real opportunity for discovery in Russia so fundamentals have not been explored and that is what I'm trying to explore, to show here. What is the reach of IQ centers, right now. And what would we discovery at then in the same for the same parameters. So then after that. So, and I think that these are very important motivation to continue except you. So then, never give up. Then, because they will produce a clarity, they are great, right, and I think that one should not stop. On the contrary, one should never give up the let's see. I think we're concerned that the next collider maybe when when we are all dead. So then, now if you consider the, the, the production from here we fix the case, you'll see that the the race is not so great. However, they have an important property they cover and the threshold ration because now. Now when when you consider heavy fixed okay you are quite illustrative due to the decay.

58:38

And then, so depends on tension between very much here we consider on the efficient production. And you see what happens, then you can you can cover regions of parameter space that are complimentary to the ones that that you can cover for direct production here I try to show you in the in the right panel. What were the situation, considering the not discovery but the Russians cover probe. So, at the 3000 embedment on, and you'll see a certain complementarity between the two cases, but you also see visions in which you can discover the integral you know the true gayness as I said before, and you have this important channel that they will be able, perhaps, to tell you an additional way of determining the Higgs is that they think is a substitute that the machine worked a lot on, and many other people and I think that has to be stress and again, very important. So my last minute. Regarding direct dictation bounds, if you had that mattering effects in audition. I think it's important to stress that the bounce today, and these are represented in this plot. So, are very strong for the case that Muse positive for me or negative, the direct spin independent bounce are not so strong, and will allow you to essentially to go to analysis of parameters. So, and I think that has to we call because usually presented as a cicada for the scenarios but I think it's important to stress that that even in MSM you can avoid violence very simply. I leave a spin in the pen.

1:00:21

Okay, since I don't have any time. Let me, let me tell you the future collider searches of course we will be such as talks, but we thought that 100 Db collider we could explore a much larger region of parameter space. And that is something we should all be looking for. But, but I will not stress, anything here so then I just refer you to this, whereby my long one.

1:00:48

A, and finally since we will have new say we care about the immune animal of the mind at the moment. Let me stress that if you have like electroweak Enos, so they, you can fit the person the current anomaly provided the, the light of the trickiness of their attention beat ISI so for instance if you put tension with the 10. So you can explain the normally provided the light slept on Sunday, and the radius of 250. But if you go to 50. You can do it with heavier nutrients that are more difficult to test the experimental. Let me also stress that we will go to a case of February nose. So then, when we need larger values of tension beta to fit these, and the essentially by the virus of tension beta increase by a factor of four to six, so you need, you will need by yourself. So for 250 gb for retention data so for 40 to 250 to fit to fit the minimum. Okay, so then let me conclude this very brief summary of some of the supersymmetry properties. I mean, at some point of time stunning that I've been part of this activity to failure than about 600 to one TV although there are many variants in the case of who stops. And I hope that will materialize in the next talk. We are starting to constrain the regions Tomasi consistent with emphasis on kings mass. A. There is no clear deviation cobblestone or potations that leads to alignment and also you know in the MSM, and they can be in the NMS sn can lead to later stops. There is still clear room for discovery of the lead see that the dielectric in our case is very obvious case that the electric sector is still unexplored in, in many regions of parameters. And of course electrical sort of escape I don't have to tell you that could lead to a solution to a matter promise and tension with current regulation the attack could be highly ameliorated false negative by yourself. Okay, thank you.

1:03:12

And I feel like we should all at least unmute and clap after a talk at odd for me to have like complete silence after talk. Well, you will clap, if you can clap if you agree to clap. Right. Right. Exactly.

1:03:27

To say yes okay and in my case I will boo but that's what people say.

1:03:34

I cannot expect anything more than from you know. Anyway, out of the out of questions.

1:03:44

I think there's this man has his hand up.

1:03:50

Stan.

1:03:53

Yes, sorry to find the unmute button.

1:03:57

Two points. First of all, I was very happy that you made the connection between g minus two and electric particles. I think we are in potentially a unique time or there's a unique opportunity. If the new measurement confirms the old data. And we could easily go to five sigma. And if Suzy can fix something, it should fix this and this indeed implies exactly what you said, which of the light electric particles and I think this is something that should be thoroughly explored I don't think that this connection is we made well enough so far. So, this is very good. Another point. You were talking about the Higgs mass that is also very close to my heart.

1:04:42

And let me, let me switch on the camera I think it's nice everyone can see each other. Yeah. So, the Higgs mass, and you were saying correctly, that there's of course, kind of the non observation of stops is in full agreement with the Higgs mass calculation. Now, but I think it's still possible to have also lower Higgs masses which are constrained or which are the limits. If the other one is very heavy. Only I think at this point and I want to hear your opinion on this. I think the calculations are simply not reliable enough. Yeah. So I think one paper from about 20 years ago where this kind of mass hierarchy has been considered but there's no real reliable calculation on this. So, in order to explore this fully, I think this could be one interesting topic that has to be covered. So it's meant to make it clear a which, which had it are you talking about, sorry the hierarchy between the light and the heavy stop. Now, good I so that that I think is something very interesting. Back in the time when, when the case was discovered, and there was presumably an anomaly in the, in the case to gamma gamma with machine Marcella and Stefania we dreamt of the facility that I needed the problem is hard to compute the the Higgs mass, the property the right direction to the Higgs mass is that we, We try to those that are not motivated by these by modality by the by the Genesis with with with Nardini ketose and Marcella, and it's very hard right so but but yes, You know I didn't talk about that because

1:06:37

simply because putting missionary stops is simpler and then I read that idea, but but it's still a possibility yeah I know you're running yeah and the I don't know exactly so in that, in that, in that word with Antonio.

1:06:57

We explore the possibility that one of the stops was was like, from the point of view of fantasy run. Yeah, of course a. We try to make it consistent with the Higgs by 99 extrapolation of the one to Formula One type in a proper a RC study of this facility is in order. Yes, of course. I think that would be even better if we had a experimental motivation. So people, people will certainly concentrate on these but the. But yeah, I suppose silly thing is, he's a very excitable person.

1:07:36

And, as you say, it's very difficult to compute.

1:07:43

Thanks I see Jordan Stark has his hand up.

1:07:49

Hi. Oh, maybe I should try.

1:07:52

I saw one thing that I thought was a little bit interesting, especially cuz I'm a mentalist. You mentioned about the stop mass and square For example, to be sort of compatible with the shape you expect the stock match to be somewhere between two to TV. Ah, I guess I should don't follow the reasoning there cuz I imagined in my head that if you're arguing, from the point of a quantum level question to the Higgs mass, a lighter stop will be easier to argue for than a stop butters on the order of one to two TV, I would expect it, you know, I, I see that there are two aspects of it.

1:08:43

One is I believe what you have in mind the fact that the lighter stops, give, give, smaller corrections to estimates parameter. And therefore, are more easily consistent with electricity directly now what what do we expect from the standard fundamentals.

1:09:02

And there's the other aspect that is the stop mass. Once you ensure the correct military symmetry again. They sorry the Higgs mass. They the physical Higgs mass is controlled mainly by the quarter companies, and the quality capitalists are game by by something that is proportional to gauge cabin square plus the production center control with the stock masses, is there, unfortunately, were in them as the same at least, and assuming the center stock masses so a lot of carriers. Do you need a series of stops. So in order to move the quantity Caplin to the value that we have set up, not to generate the proper Higgs mass parameter. So the Higgs my parameter equated with the, with a vacuum petition value and the quartic coupling with the, with the Higgs mass ascension. So they are two different aspects, and they are in somewhat tension with each other. So one that tells you, okay, I better prefer to have this stoplight, and the other, they do better to have this to carry this tension has been a of course emphasized by many people. What I tried to say a little bit in the talk is that there are a lot of caveats on all these statements for many reasons. One is the reason that Sven said that they did not emphasize that one stock can be lighter than the other one. And therefore, you can still have a life stop with an error that is very.

1:10:33

The other is that there might be a hidden correlations or specific parameters that bring you this, this top to be like that in spite of the fact that naively you, you would assume that the, sort of, that, that, that allows you, that allow you to have one nice top under heavy, even if namely us by both tops to be to be hairy. So, and the other is that you can have an extension of the standard model, where the quality copy and receive corrections have come from from other sector, for instance, Mr semi Sonic sample, in which he learned so such heavy stops to fit the Higgs mass. So therefore, there are a lot of caveats on these. The only thing I wanted to say that the to simplify matters is that the pressing bounce on desktops setup and you should not consider a psyche, as a killer of them SSM. Because, if anything, if you make the simple assumption on the on the Higgs mass that is the general stops, then you will see that you need stop masses are further of the ones that are still to explore.

1:11:46

So that is the only thing. But, so there are a lot of curiosity statements so when should not take any of these statements in any malicious way, the only truth, who has experienced, tennis, then we are looking for you to discover it to record the stops. So Carlos just one more, one thing that I wanted to add to that is, I mean obvious, some somewhat obvious, but the contribution from the stops to the Higgs mass is logarithmic. Right. not quadratic. Right. That is true. So then so what the machine is trying to say that the Higgs mass parameter is controlled by Quadra corrections on the, on the sub masses. Instead, the, the Higgs mass, the lambda the quantity Caplin that controls a fixed mass depends only logarithmically on the, on the stock market. Yeah. And that is an important carrier. But again, they the the quality dependence on the stock masses, is a very naive that and, and essentially you need to have the control and ultraviolet behavior to know what is the right behavior at low energies. So, so therefore you need to know what is going on at the messenger scale so many of the analysis of fine tuning ignore this deeper a deeper truth. And then, so you can get wrong answer. so that is something that I try to emphasize, not very clearly probably in my first slides.

1:13:20

Thanks, looks like maybe we'll take one more question from Oregon whose hand is raised.

1:13:27

Hi Carlos.

1:13:29

How are you, good to see you.

1:13:32

Good to see ya. Good to see you. Yeah. So, I mean do you do you foresee any kind of theoretical development or experimental evidence and let's say in the next five to 10 years who could give us some guidance on what energy would need for future energy frontier machine.

1:13:54

Yeah, it's a very good question. So then, that is a dream. We all have. Then, I believe, again that the.

1:14:04

Even if we know for instance, so the, what they try to emphasize is that, in my opinion, the largest room for discovery. That will give us information is in the electric sector, so then the cellphone and through keynotes should be. Continue could could lead to start. So imagine that we discovered through dinos with masses of order 300 shillings and then suddenly g matters to us when is dreaming about remains discrepant, and suddenly it was, we can fit it then. So I would say that the very unlikely. In that case, that they got our political remodel done, and an order of magnitude heavier than that. So then, so will give us some hope on this although no no totally clear that the the probably 100 the collider will be in there right in the right direction. So, unfortunately, you're going so that I am as good guesser as you then I. These are only hopes, right. Unfortunately, I don't know, I have my hope, put in the luxury sector and I still dreaming for a stop signal, but the doesn't seem to be there that is right now. So, one more thought here talking about future.

1:15:32

I think like electric youth would also be a very strong case five plus or minus machines.

1:15:39

Right. Yeah, they are. They can be easily superior depending on the center of mass energy and. So if one thinks about this, not only the NFC then even the IOC in its final stage could probably cover very large parts of the relevant parameter space or maybe this depends on the values. Some, some accesses will guarantee.

1:16:02

The discovery. Yeah, yeah.

1:16:05

I agree with you so imagine that we had, we had such case that the Kino saddled with my sister for a few hundred degree. Of course I will motivate even more.

1:16:18

If see if I can get it to one TV, because that will allow you to explore the region, fully then.

1:16:25

And that might happen right but what unfortunately might happen too late for any decision you simply make. So then, let's hope that something happens, then soon.

1:16:39

1:16:42

Great. Thank you, Carlos thanks for all the good questions and discussion. I guess we shouldn't move on to our next talk, which is from Sam vine who will tell us about pm SSM studies.

1:17:02

Okay, let me mute myself. Although, I still should stop share right.

1:17:08

So, I think I can start. Yeah, let me stop share.

1:17:16

Okay.

1:17:20

Yeah. So thanks, Carlos I actually only caught the second half of your talk because anytime I get an email from Jim I automatically think that the times he's referring to are. central time.

1:17:32

Sorry about that I should have been more clear I didn't read carefully enough but thanks for the reminder so I still caught the second half of the talk and then from the summary I could tell that there were things that that were covered that. That I'll go into a little bit. And I think after some of the discussion I even understand my own talk a little bit better.

1:17:53

Okay, so I assume you can see these slides so I will just proceed and to say something if you can, um, so I'm going to talk about some of the P MSM studies that are going on, kind of in the context of CMS, the CMS, Suzy program.

1:18:12

So I'll just kind of start big picture again I, you just got a really great big picture but let me just do this intro a little bit so. So generally, as far as I can tell, supersymmetry seems to be most widely motivated for use in interpreting analyses and designing analyses. For these three reasons. One is that they're, they're naturalness arguments for supersymmetry, particularly that that motivate that note not only should there be Susy but it should be sort of kinematically accessible with TV scale colliders. Secondly, that many Susy scenarios could explain dark matter, or account for either partially or totally or too much. And then sort of a third philosophy is just that well, even if you don't like these first two reasons that supersymmetry just provides a consistent model, which is actually itself a broad set of models that just allows you to sort of test the reach of analyses identify gaps in coverage and track your progress as you go in terms of sensitivity.

1:19:25

Just to give kind of a flavor of that there is these four sort of simplified model diagrams which feature different particles being produced. And I ordered them very naively in terms of from most hopeless which would be like pure Urbino Dark Matter pair production with nothing else involved to sort of the least hopeless would, which would be something like Louis no production were at CMS or Atlas you would reconstruct events with very large missing transverse momentum and tons of just lying around.

1:20:00

Okay. So, if we're going to talk about supersymmetry then, and we're going to be serious then then the most simple model that we can consider really is the minimal supersymmetric standard model. So it's worth just reminding ourselves how complex this model is.

1:20:20

And so, so basically the the foundations of the model are that you you don't assume anything about the Susy braking mechanism. And then you just allow for the set of all soft Susy braking terms in the Lagrangian to appear, and you're left with a number of free parameters that's on a scale of about 100 107 parameters there. There are 19 original set of model parameters and then also for additional standard models sector parameters which are not technically in the standard model but they have to do with the extended with the second Higgs doublet that has to be introduced to avoid anomalies.

1:21:07

Um, and so that's a little bit difficult to work with. Before I move on to the next slide to tell you how we usually work with that, I'll just point out quickly that there that generally in this talk I'm assuming are parody conservation, and that the lightest Susy particle the LSP.

1:21:27

You know is generally some admixture of the states that are that are shown here of the bino neutral, we know a neutral Higgs he knows, because I'm going to show a lot of plots that that have a decomposition in terms of the neutral enough flavor. I just put this here so so if I ever talk about a dino like Susie model that means that, that this coefficient n one one is is greater than, than any of the others and if it's a winner like model then then n one two is greater than any of the others. Okay, that's a little side detail. Um, so, so how we generally historically at the LFC dealt with this large parameter space where we've used simplified models which have been motivated originally in, you know, other Snowmass meetings, long, long ago.

1:22:22

And these have been developed and and standardized. And so, so I took this this result actually from Snowmass 2013 white paper, where they did a little exploration of a few simplified models that were deemed, sort of, that were blessed by by the group.

1:22:45

And there they talked about, you know, glue, you know production with with cork decays about direct score production and as well as Cuttino production with sort of intermediate heavy flavor decays.

1:23:02

And then this white paper does some nice sort of projections, which I think are kind of fun to look at if you're not familiar with, with the potential sensitivity of different possible future colliders, but they took this Model T one for Q glue into production with with lights, like cork decays, and just assumed I think 20% systematic uncertainties in background and did kind of a mock up fino analysis to determine the sensitivity to the to this model for various center of mass energies, assuming.

1:23:40

In most cases 3,000% of arms so the full LFC expected integrated luminosity.

1:23:48

So you can see with 100 teeny Collider in this simplified model then we could get limits. We're actually we could, we could potentially see a discovery up to a 10 gV, we know.

1:24:00

So I think you can kind of pocket the number 10 g glue, you know, because I think it will sort of contextualize.

1:24:10

A little bit of the about the scan ranges of this parameter space that I'm going to talk about in a second.

1:24:17

Okay, so I would say generally that simplified models have been widely implemented and used and it's really been a success story of both Atlas and CMS analyses. Um, but they often leave questions open as to whether we've actually done a thorough exploration of the potential, you know phase space of the MSM. And because of those concerns people were motivated quite a while ago, like back in 2008, to put together this this other kind of very general model called the phenomenological MSN from TF Berger at all.

1:24:54

And the idea is to have kind of a compromise between a simplified model which only has, you know, two or three effective parameters, and the full emphasis on which has 100 and and that middle ground is established by making essentially four assumptions, or maybe five depending on how you count. One that there be no flavor changing neutral currents to that there's no additional CP violation, and in addition to what's already in the ck m matrix that there'd be no tacky ons that and and then for for convenience that the first and second generations fermions are mass degenerate, and that the lightest superpartner Susy particles the neutralino.

1:25:39

And by making that four set of assumptions, then you can reduce the effective parameter space from up in the hundreds down to just 19 unknown free parameters associated with this new, new model. The pm SSM. And these, these parameters are mostly just the masses the mass terms, which correlate strongly too often to physical masses of the new particles and it also includes.

1:26:08

Try linear couplings and three terms of the trade linear couplings, as well as the stand data.

1:26:17

Um, yeah, and the other sort of prejudice that's avoided by studying the phenomenological MSM is that there's really nothing assumed about the braking scale at all. And in the Susy braking scales, is just sort of defined dynamically as the geometric mean of the two stop masses. So there's very little running coupling and so forth.

1:26:42

So, both Atlas and CMS have carried out and published interpretations of their Suzy analyses. In terms of the P MSM in slightly different forms.

1:26:57

And in both cases the, the main results that have come out, have been with regard to run one. So seven in ATV searches.

1:27:06

And I think that the most.

1:27:09

My personally the most useful result that's come out of, out of those investigations are these plots of the survival probability, or the fraction of excluded models which are just one is one minus the other. So Atlas displayed fraction of excluded models and CMS display that survival probability which is the likelihood for any point to for any region and face, face to survive a set of analyses that were carried out by the experiments.

1:27:44

And these are these are results that can be directly compared to simplified model results. And so you can see how robust your simplified model is. And to give you a kind of an idea of what's been shown in these plots is there's a scan over the parameter space that allows all 19 parameters to vary randomly. And then in each little rectangle, there are some number of PMS some points with, you know, each one having a different random set of other parameters. And then the color tells you the fraction of models that either survived in the case of CMS or that was excluded in the case of Atlas.

1:28:23

m. CMS also provided a sort of a different followed a different kind of paradigm for the interpretation. And that had to do with presenting Bayesian posterior densities, as a way to display the impact of the CMS data so. So that's what you see here on the right plot. there was a prior density probability density associated with just the pre CMS constraints and that's in blue. And then after various suites of CMS analyses you see how the posterior density which is black and red as changed. With respect to the prior where here we're talking about the LSP mass.

1:29:07

Also you have some different kinds of methods that have been used in the past.

1:29:11

Um, okay so that's all run one stuff, let me jump quickly to run to and I'll tell you what happened with the CMS scan. So, there was an interpretation of a single analysis from CMS, which analyze events in the all hydronic channel, looking for basically events with many jets and missing transverse momentum.

1:29:33

And that analysis was used was interpreted in terms of the same run one PMS SM scan, and the results are shown on the right so the left hand plot is what you just looked at the survival probability after all on one searches that were included. And on the right, you have the circle survival probability of for the for the key MSM to, to not be excluded by this one Multijet search. You can see that except for kind of a few straggling points in the upper right corner.

1:30:09

The vast majority of the phase space, even like three TV bluenose points with three t Leno's have been excluded so it's almost there very, very few surviving points left in out of a set of 7200 original points in the scan. There are only a couple hundred that that even survived this one analysis.

1:30:31

So, so kind of, I think this makes it clear that that the old scan that was used of this 10,000 ish number of famous seven points is not going to be really useful in terms of helping us understand our run to searches, because they're just so heavily constrained.

1:30:50

Um, so taking note of that. I think it makes a little bit of sense why why we're trying to take this course of action for one, two, so first of all we want to perform a new scan in the pm SSM.

1:31:03

We want to sample. Well, the plan is to sample a large number of points, a larger number of points than before. to achieve sort of a usability high density higher density than than previously. Also, most importantly, I think to extend the reach.

1:31:22

In terms of mass, because the particle masses were just generally too small. In the old scan to allow them to be useful.

1:31:33

But then we want to sort of cover and emphasize particular interesting regions and phenomenological features a little bit more than what was done before, so I'll go into that in a couple minutes, and then other things we want to do is try to incorporate, you know both inclusive and targeted analyses and a wider range of analyses generally. So, because we're including more phenomenological features it also makes sense to include more analyses that are that are targeting those those phenomenological features. We do want to keep having both the Bayesian and frequentist exclusion types of interpretations and and then we're also thinking about how we can provide more useful feedback for theorists to use after the analysis that lets me move on to slide nine, where I'm, I'm listing our choices for the new parameter ranges of the scan, and that's on the right for run two. For comparison, the run one scan dimensions are here on the left.

1:32:37

And you can just see that we're sort of extending the box up marginally for the electroweak and and what tonic sectors. m one m two and x emu were bounded, according to their absolute values by three TV. That's going to move to four TV.

1:32:58

And then the strong particles the particles of su three charge were previously limited bounded above by three TV and now they'll be allowed to grow up to 10 TV. That's actually the biggest difference.

1:33:13

And the idea is that, we'll do sort of a similar process so throw millions of random points in the subspace.

1:33:21

Once a point has been thrown that means you've specified a Lagrangian.

1:33:25

Then we compute the spectrum. Currently we're using, we use you know.

1:33:31

And then we accept points, according to a likelihood which is based on a large suite of pre, pre run two results. So that's non CMS results and also run one CMS results.

1:33:44

And that's a process that's billed as mC mC Markov chain Monte Carlo. And it basically allows you to arrive at a density of points that approximates a posterior density which allows this kind of Bayesian interpretation to take place. As a note we're not including and we'd also previously did not include Dark Matter observables directly into the likelihood of this mC mC. Because, on, on one hand they tend to be a little bit more assumptions based so you have to assume things like dark matter is only a single particle if you don't assume that, then a lot of these constraints, kind of change or they slip away. And we wanted to avoid having those kinds of biases so we just left Dark Matter observables out, but we do plan on emphasizing certain interesting Dark Matter regions, we just don't want it to. We don't want them to bias the shapes of the scan.

1:34:44

Okay so here on slide 10 is just the set of the parameters that have that are relevant for su three strong color charged particles so gluey nose and sparks and stuff like that. You can see them sort of extending up to tend to Ed.

1:35:03

Just to give you a flavor of these boundaries. And then the electroweak parameters are shown a suite here.

1:35:13

Yeah, not not too much to say but this just gives you kind of a sense of what values are taken in the scan.

1:35:21

Um, and I just want to walk through a few perks of the new range choices. So one benefit that we'll get from, particularly from having the, the Camino scored boundary go up to 10 TV.

1:35:35

Is that we'll be able to explore this score clue you know decoupling limit, better than last time.

1:35:42

Another perk is that now with these kinds of boundaries, we often are getting the correct Higgs boson mass.

1:35:51

Third one Td xenos are abundant, and I'll go into a little bit why that might be interesting.

1:35:58

And then generally we place more emphasis on electroweak production.

1:36:04

And it'll end and we're allowed to sort of explore more interesting electroweak scenarios. And then finally, this time we're going to try to tackle a larger set of long lived signatures, pertaining to electroweak dinos but also styles and stops.

1:36:22

Okay, so there's a slide on each of those bullet points. Slide 13 is the score quino decoupling limit. So this plot on the right here is the survival probability. In bins of the Galeano mass, that was arrived from the set of run ones, CMS Susan searches. So, in any given bin, you know some fraction of points survived the analyses.

1:36:47

But you can see that even up to the highest range of the scan of two three TV for the Covina mass. The survival probability is still increasing, which means that somehow even though these gloominess we don't usually think of them as like playing a role, if, if there are three TV we don't produce them.

1:37:04

They're still playing a role they're impossible to completely decouple, given the range choices that that were made them kind of help understand that you can look at the diagram here on the left which shows, sort of a tea channel process that involves the glue, you know.

1:37:24

And there's also an equivalent process that that that that allows for sport pair production.

1:37:34

And for these kinds of Fineman diagrams the gluey no actually plays a role, even if it's too heavy to be pair produced.

1:37:43

And so we want to try to include points in the scan, where these diagrams are suppressed, we can really just consider scenarios where, you know, you just decoupled the whole strong sector.

1:37:57

We think going to 10 TV will allow for better coverage there.

1:38:01

But we'll have to see and really you know if we actually achieved it probably, we probably won't know for sure until after we've actually done some interpretations.

1:38:12

Also just generally going from three TV for the blue, you know, upper bound to 10, just makes it so that more points have a dominant electroweak you know cross section.

1:38:23

Because what we found previously was that there were just in almost every PMS at some point, there was a score or a gluey no flying around that just took all the cross section, and was able to be excluded by a Multijet net search. And I think it. I mean this time we'll be able to, I think, Take a bit more of a microscope into the sensitivity of electroweak targeted searches.

1:38:49

Okay. The third part is the Higgs mass now, so this. I really enjoyed the the conversation that was had about this I think I learned a little bit about what's going on here. So as you probably know the Higgs mass is not the free parameter in the MSM. It's a predicted parameter.

1:39:08

And what we've done is we've placed just a window cut on the Higgs mass for the scan, so that all points have MH between 120 and 130.

1:39:17

But we found was that this window was almost not necessary, just due to the natural range of values taken by the Higgs mass given, given the parameter pounds that we chosen.

1:39:28

And this is pointed out as a big determining factor in getting the Higgs mass right is is having a stop mass range that is sort of compatible.

1:39:40

So you can see that here I've written the, the dependence of the Higgs mass in terms of a few of the Susy Lagrangian parameters here. And you can see that that log dependence that that you guys were talking about the ratio of the top to the top mass.

1:40:00

And because we're going up to 10 TV and that that hasn't really been.

1:40:06

That's not the range that people like traditionally focused on like Cz up to 10 TV. But because we are extending up to that range, it means that most SOPs are like between two and three, TV, and that that gives us the Higgs mass that's much closer to the measured value.

1:40:26

Okay and then one TV Exynos.

1:40:30

So, these have been sort of studied as kind of an interesting

1:40:37

class of models, and recently in a number of female papers, but the the main driving reason for that is that one TV xenos are known to accommodate the known Dark Matter relic density, for example, that as measured by plunk. And so if you do have a one, two, xeno, then, then you don't need it.

1:40:58

You don't need any other like special processes to to correct for the dark matter, density.

1:41:06

The same is true for Windows but for typically around two TV or so.

1:41:12

And you can see that in these plots here so, so the the plot in the lower left is the distribution of predicted Dark Matter relic densities throughout this new scan that we performed. And the plunk measurements is shown here at point one two and the vertical black line. You see that that most xeno points have xeno like PMS endpoints which are shown in blue are actually giving something consistent with the plunk measurement.

1:41:44

On the other hand, most winos are giving too low of a relative density and most dinos are getting too high. And that has to do with their annihilation rates.

1:41:56

If I plot all points in the scan a histogram of the LSP mass, then I get this plot in the upper right,

1:42:06

the black line just to go into this a little bit is the black dotted line is the total. And then the red green and blue are the penal like you know like and Xena like respectively models, so the sum of the colors is the black.

1:42:23

If I make the same plot but require a tight window around the Planck mass, and then plot again, the neutrino masses and then you see that there's this really dominant feature of the Higgs he knows that there so I think it's safe to say that our scan is going to be very rich in Higgs II no Dark Matter points.

1:42:45

This is kind of an interesting set of points, because one TV is too high to probe xenos directly with the LFC.

1:42:54

But it's not too high to probe them sort of indirectly, if they show up in the cascade decays of ugliness and scores.

1:43:03

But it is something that should be probed directly with one ton Direct Attach direct detection experiments like seen on one time.

1:43:14

Yeah, so that's kind of an interesting feature of the scan that we didn't have last time.

1:43:19

And then the final perk that we're gonna have this time is a lot better phenomenology with long lived particles. In this case, I'm talking about your Geno's. So, so very easily very generally we know is give rise to charge you knows with with long lifetimes of, you know, order, up to a mirror so see towels.

1:43:43

But last the last iteration of this analysis and for run one really neglected all points with C tau greater than 10 centimeters. So that was kind of an unfortunate omission that this time we're going to be able to avoid to rectify.

1:44:04

Also it's a little bit interesting that Exynos also can be a little bit long lived. If you allow the other electronic parameters, namely m one and m two to be sufficiently high. I don't mean really just plays but I mean like micro displacement. So that's what's shown here on the right, as calculated by soft Susy.

1:44:24

This. This is the C tau and millimeters of a pure Higgs of mostly periods, you know, second neutralino, as well as charged you know so the probably the more interesting one is the charge you know, and by going up to four t v four m one and m two with the new scan values, which corresponds to 3.6.

1:44:47

When you look at the log, then that means that we'll also have some points that have hit xeno charge he knows that had seat house on the order of a millimeter so kind of micro displacements kinds of signatures, which I think could be kind of interesting.

1:45:05

Other Long live stuff that we're going to try to look into. I think is pretty correlated with, if, if you, if you look at the picture of the PMS PMS SM that's dark matter compatible, and particularly if you look at Urbino light points. Then, then you can get some long live signatures that are sort of relevant there and that we want to consider and illustrate that here in the upper right. I'm just showing the raw distribution of PMS SM points with a Veena like LSP in the plane of the LSP and style mass.

1:45:41

And then in the lower right the same set of points, but selected for satisfying the dark matter relic density. You can see that there's this diagonal feature that appears here, and that that has to do with the fact that the Beano doesn't normally have a large enough annihilation cross section. But if it's nearly degenerate with most other Susy particles in this case the style, then that increases the site annihilation rate and it can actually give you the desire develop density on. So these kind of really compressed vino scenarios are interesting on their own. Um, and they don't tend to be things that were sensitive to using our prompt analyses, but they are potentially points that could be probed by looking at sort of more long loop signatures so here's a result from john Ellis at all on the left, which, which indicates that this the sow is actually itself long lived. Detective Lee long lived, assuming that the delta m is less than a few.

1:46:51

So it could actually be that kind of disappearing track analyses and others that have long lived style analyses can target some of these points.

1:47:01

So we want to cover that phenomenology as well.

1:47:04

Okay so that covers the perks that we sort of get from the scan boundaries. But then we want to go a little bit further and try to emphasize some other interesting regions, and we do that using a pic probability, that's used to implement an over sampling.

1:47:21

So, you know, after the mC mC scan we have 100 million points to choose from. We can't afford to simulate all those we will simulate some number.

1:47:31

But we want to pick certain points with a higher probability than others than remember that probability and fold that probability back into any distribution, so that we basically can increase the resolution of the scan, where we want without biasing any of the shapes of the distributions. And we're going to over sample based on a few different criteria. One is we want to over sample low fine tuning regions, whereby fine tuning we're taking this delta electroweak measure as defined by how we bear at all. And, which basically looks at the, the minimization condition for the emphasis on Super potential and and sort of looks at all the corrections to the Zed mass, and is a measure of how much cancellation. There has to be in order to give you the right said mass.

1:48:25

We also want to over sample based on the relative density itself.

1:48:31

And also a number of other features which I won't go into here but they include like stops also points that are consistent with, like, certain anomalies like d minus two anomalies and and a few other considerations.

1:48:46

When you look at this over sampling altogether. What it does is it allows you to do a little bit more dedicated investigations into whether you might have, what are the features of points that satisfy a particular condition desired condition.

1:49:03

And it also lets you look into a set of points that might satisfy multiple conditions. So whether the low fine tuning scenarios that are also consistent with the dark matter relic abundance. That's kind of an interesting story on its own. Um, one thing we generally see from.

1:49:23

Well, from what the oversampling allows us to see is that when we look at the dark matter compatible points.

1:49:30

It tends to favor the compressed spectrum in general, and that's that's true whether you look at Beano or we know or Haseena light cases and that's that's shown here in slide 18.

1:49:45

I think that also has kind of a knock on effect that we will sample higher, where we're close to the limits of our experimental boundaries. So that will allow us to kind of like, improve limits more marginally.

1:50:03

Okay, now here's something that's just I just threw in for fun, because there's a master's student in my group working on it. He's looking into how machine learning can potentially be applicable here. And in his investigation we identified that that the most difficult one of the most difficult things that that theorists have to do when making sense of the experimental results, is to estimate the acceptance of any given model, but because the PMP exam is such a large general model. There are actually a lot of sub models that fit within it.

1:50:38

That if you're able to cast a particular model in terms of, you know, What does it look like in terms of the PMS exam if you're able to build an SLA file, then, then it would be nice if you just had a tool that let you estimate the acceptance, because that's sort of the key and defining a likelihood if you want to know if any given point is excluded or not.

1:51:00

Um, so he's examining using regression techniques with deep neural networks to, to try to regress on a suite of SL h a level PMS SM parameters and and to target the the acceptances themselves, which will be things that CMS actually computes when carrying out this. The combination, and just kind of as a proof of principle that that's doing something that's not crazy Bogdan was able to show that the neural network can actually predict the, the acceptance, as a function of various model parameters so here you have.

1:51:50

Here you have the basically the acceptance on the y axis, it says filter efficiency, but as the acceptance. And on the x axis you have some physics quantity, this is the delta m between the church, you know, the lightest church you know and the LSP. You have these different populations in here which correspond to the, the we know like events and the Higgs Nina like events and the bino like events, and the left is the true efficiency versus the delta m and the right is the neural network efficiency versus the delta is actually able to give a pretty good prediction of the acceptance, just using this neural network and using some kind of pseudo data using like a really cursory set of acceptance estimates that we did for the sake of his study so I personally think that something like that being provided could could be interesting for theorists to use and recast models. I don't know that anyone is committing to having this be a result but it's kind of a new thing.

1:52:51

Okay, so that already picked me to the end. Um, yeah so the larger picture is that we are planning to have basically a similar but expanded analysis with respect to run one.

1:53:02

We want to have more plots that are dedicated to sort of particular phenomenological features. We're going to incorporate a sampling, which lets us emphasize those regions, but also preserves, being able to do a Bayesian interpretation.

1:53:17

And we hope to incorporate more analyses and final states into the end results.

1:53:25

And then the last thing we're thinking about is what kind of information we want to provide, and probably that that will that will most definitely include kind of the things that were provided last time survival probabilities in terms of 1d and 2d, 2d projections. and these kind of Bayesian objects. Also the set of SLA files, along with the likelihoods that are derived from the combination. And then just maybe hopefully tools for estimating the acceptance.

1:53:56

But we'll see how that one goes.

1:53:58

So thanks for your attention and be happy to take any questions about what we're doing.

1:54:06

Thank you, Sam. I see some hands raised. Great. So why don't we start with Jordan, who has his hands up first.

1:54:16

Hi. Sure, um, thanks for the talk. I actually think there's a lot of information here thought probably each particular sort of sectoral could go into a separate our call. I wanted to pick on maybe slide 14, which is where you talk about the star mass, and the Higgs.

1:54:39

So, what I'm trying to understand here because you're showing your prior and posterior distributions.

1:54:48

If you sample the entire face space, and then you apply some sort of window cut here on your Fix mask.

1:54:58

I'm pretty sure you're gonna start bias and towards the top of your stock Master, which I think he did mostly mentioned here, but how do you ensure that you still get enough sampling at the latest done man says.

1:55:13

That's a great question yes so we actually have a dedicated over sampling for light stops, because for exactly that reason so you write natively we didn't get enough density for low stop mass, but so we basically define the probability so it's dependent. It's basically a stepwise function of the stop mass. So if the stop is less than the TV's and we're like, 10 times more likely to pick the point and if it's other otherwise if it's less than 1.5, then we're like five times more likely.

1:55:44

So it lets us kind of at least sample the interesting low light stop scenarios.

1:55:52

It's it's a fix. It's kind of a bandaid.

1:55:56

Right. Do you have something that we're looking at this too early, sort of trying to all stop ourselves from trying to buy as the same thing.

1:56:09

And I don't want to mention our like density at the moment because it's a very difficult one anyway. But do you generally have an automated procedure to do this or do each and we just kind of, you know, just sample your entire play space. When you make pause of everything, and think about the selection to trying to make for what you're looking for, and then try to figure out where you might not be sampling enough.

1:56:37

Um, so the sampling density will follow the pre CMS constraints. The assumed prior for the mC mC is just that it's, it's flat in the dimensions of of the the pram of the 19 explicit parameters. But then the like you know BTS gamma and you know Lh CB and the DSM emu kinds of measurements and constraints are used to steer the sampling so that regions that are still allowed are sampled with a higher density and regions that are not allowed or sampled with lower density.

1:57:16

so that's that's sort of automated by the mC mC and the likelihood

1:57:24

to get answered part of your question I'm not sure if I got everything.

1:57:29

No, I think, shorter answer.

1:57:33

You're gonna have to somehow align the mC mC to catch things that interested in find. So for example, in the case of the star mouse when you're making a selection on the Higgs mass. If you happen to notice that the lighter stops were not being picked up. You wouldn't know without being able to make a plot of the sample distributions of the prior. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. So, so in that case we. There could be somewhat of a bias, although we found that just the, as I mentioned, like the native range of the stop mass gave rise to the Higgs mass peaking at like, you know, 124 so. So the window cut actually doesn't apply that much of a bias which we just honestly kind of lucked into.

1:58:21

But then what the strategy we tried to take was actually identify individual areas where we're worried we're not sampling with enough density just based on our human bias about whether interesting points. And then, over sampled they're particularly low stop mass, but that part's not automatic that that's more like, Oh, we see there's a problem in low stop mass let's sample more.

1:58:50

Thanks Sam Thank you Jordan for the good question.

1:58:54

I'll say that this these are really important discussions and I'm hoping they're just starting, and we I look forward to picking on you, Sam and Jordan, for our, you know future work in this area for Snowmass.

1:59:08

Let's keep going on more questions from Sven.

1:59:13

This. Hi. Thanks a lot for this nice overview and I'm really happy that Atlas and CMS are both exploring more than just simplified models that you were touching upon in the beginning.

1:59:25

I have one general criticism in the way things are shown. Often you were talking about survival probabilities, or how many models, how which percentage survives. And I think there's really no physics meaning in this point density doesn't carry any physical meaning. And when you talk about over sampling. Then you even throw more points there and so I don't think it makes sense to talk about this now but this is something that one sees very often, from theory, and from x mentalist. I don't think that one can really say this part from space is more probable than another because more points survive them. So one, I think one should try to avoid this kind of.

2:00:14

Yeah, wrong presentation of the results, the results on principle are very nice first one talks about smile quality, bilities etc I don't think it gives the right message. I don't know whether you want to comment on this, but I have a physics. Yeah, I mean, to me, I kind of equate that criticism with, like, how can you trust your prior like why should you choose exactly you know that this, we don't know the prior, this is the point, right, and I but I mean this is not really a discussion for me to innovate on I mean this is basically the oldest problem that exists in Beijing so if you don't like to do it, you won't like using statements.

2:00:57

Yeah.

2:00:58

I mean, one can just say what one can present the results in, let's say, in a correct way in this respect, I think. No, I don't say that the results of such a not correct I believe everything that you did just. I think I made a point. But the other point is actually related to the slide beyond just watching.

2:01:23

First, but to quantum physics question. In the end, as opposed to apply it stronger cut on the line six miles to get your preferred parameter space is this correct.

2:01:36

Um, or did you live with the Kenji v window, we live with the 10 g window. Right, yeah. Then I think there's room for improvement, because well with the extra metal value is pretty well known. And if one uses the best coats on the market.

2:01:53

They give you an uncertainty of about one gv. Ah, and I think I suppose you use theano to calculate the masses yeah because I can calculate if you're in a very complicated situation can have 10 TV stop monitors, you can have light electric particles so the calculation becomes can become quite involved and, I think, one would do better with a dedicated coat.

2:02:21

I will not make advertisement for my own calculations now but if we discuss more about this.

2:02:27

I think you could really profit from this because you would cut out a large part of the, otherwise not parameter space. Okay. Yeah, and I think this would really could drastically improve for resolve reduce the number of points that you're having. So I was, my, my, I didn't realize that the uncertainties of Trump to the GED, I thought, well it depends on the parameter point, you really want an evaluation, based on the parameter point, not a general one. Okay.

2:02:56

But also, this is done by by certain codes. Yeah. I yeah I'd be interested in that if you want to forward. I mean, to some extent you know a lot of choices have already been made, but I think that but if you ever read anything or yeah but maybe I can just ask, like, I mean, do you really expect the phenomenology to be very, very different for a while, it depends if the code that you're using gives you a answer that is off by five kV from the correct, let's say, best possible answer, then you could focus on performance space that is really not favored when you say here this plot where you saw the upper plot.

2:03:40

Everything is fine this large peak 124 gb. If this was shifted substantially and then you apply the real cut of the parameter space you may be in an entirely. You may be focusing on a different part of the parameter space, cut out some others that are then clearly defamed. This could happen.

2:03:59

Thank you sir I'm sorry I don't mean to, to move on these are good comments, um, we have one more talk so I'm yeah let's take one more quick question from Howie bear.

2:04:11

And then we'll move on to the next. Yeah, I would just like to urge not putting too much emphasis on the relative density, for instance, for trying to get a one TV Higgs xeno. You're really boxing out all the axioms that would provide you with a solution to the strong CP problem and cube CD. So, I would just probably it's best to just let the relative density be below the measured value, and not emphasize that it's right out the measured value because you do need the ACCION usually to enter into the fray.

2:04:55

I appreciate that comment yeah so this is exactly why we didn't allow the relative density into the mC mC and rather we just do an over sampling which gets weighted out so it shouldn't bias distributions at the end, just so you can kind of do a dedicated study and say well what what if, what if the LSP were accounting for 100% of dark matter. Then, then how would things be but but yeah to take that with a grain of salt i think that's that's that's good to get that people.

2:05:25

Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Excellent. Thank you. Thank you, Sam for the very nice talk.

2:05:33

As I said, we will be in touch in the future so you can help us with our scan plan scans for the snow mask process.

2:05:43

Sure. Sounds good. Thanks, you okay great so the last talk is from Mikael who will tell us about an ILC perspective.

2:05:57

Are you able to show your to share your slides yeah I see they're they're excellent.

2:06:02

Okay, go ahead. Thank you. Yep. Okay.

2:06:06

Um, okay so I'm trying to give a, an IT perspective on searches, actually.

2:06:16

Only the RPC supersede f this was the original title of this vessel. This session.

2:06:28

So, my outline is first to try to say what what do we actually know about to see now, and I will do a bit of comments about how to versus what was said about to say in the briefing book to the European strategy.

2:06:46

And in particular, sort of, putting a more plus or minus emphasis to what was in principle correctly film.

2:06:57

And then I basically pass through a picture gallery of of ILC studies that has already been done at IBC so you get a bit of a feeling and then I will conclude with some sort of general points in equity of interest for for this no mess is an effort.

2:07:21

So, what we, we do know is that not true the hierarchy problem. Probably the dock Master, the master wall. All of this would prefer to have a light electric sector. And that except for the third generation school to college. Second doesn't really, really matter too much for this.

2:07:43

And in, in the case that the LSP is mainly hexane or mainly we know that electro executory is compressed.

2:07:53

And in that case, most particle decay decays or via cascades I mean, at the end of these cascades this mass difference is more typical for this kind of topology say at the ceiling energy limits are for specific models and the real definite limits are still, I would say what more left to

2:08:21

is definitely excluding.

2:08:25

And the same basic goes for leptons in general around the star in particular.

2:08:32

So, so what we're looking at is

2:08:40

taking the plus or minus approach to what an exclusion means an exclusion means that you should not have to power meters and if you say that that point is excluded means that all other parameters. There's no other parameter not shown in the block that that could invalidate the statement at that point is excluded. Basically, survival probability zero at that point to use the language of the previous talk.

2:09:09

So, you could take this approach. And as I said, looking at MSM whether or by the conservation.

2:09:19

And I would say from, from experience from from from left that our paid validation typically seems to be easier at the plus or minus.

2:09:30

We want to assume CP consolation.

2:09:35

And you don't really know what the x mental implications of CP violation would RS is would need need studying the plus or minus context.

2:09:49

We also assume that it's not a storm and that is a NSP, which is also would expect to be the best possible case, possibly for the, the, the style.

2:10:04

And that case the, the nsps and being a win or exceed are more or less are seen with exactly the same normally get us in the previous

2:10:16

talks, it just means that the, the highest coefficient is. Is the being a winner or exceed and all that gets particularly, not necessarily pure will be in a winner racino.

2:10:28

So in this case and one into a new one of the main players in in the parameter space, and we can say that basically any values and combinations assign signs up to values that makes Pacino's out of reach for, for any new facility which then would be a few TV, and also very out of the paramita suite ima, and as well remasters. And, and that's the only prejudice No, no explanation of dark matter no explanation as to just

2:11:11

just basically seeing in the worst possible case can be still, still exclude points.

2:11:18

So am I can paint with a broad brush what the spectrum looks like.

2:11:26

So if the. The LSP is 16 like, then this is a typical plot you get in there in the scene which are the LSB and LSP Ticino spectrum so you complete the populate along the, the smooth mascot friends diagonal. And in the vino it's even more, more, so that you know really on on the smallness difference and only in The Beano case with the mask difference basically be anything.

2:12:04

So, yeah, I just said only in the been with SP case, would you expect to have basically any masterpiece In all other cases, you would expect the masturbating to be small.

2:12:18

So now, looking how they assume situation was presented. So there's of course, a long chapter about the candidate sector which is basically.

2:12:32

None ob plus or minus business that is pretty much nothing that he has in mind is could add to what p p will would say about the color sector but on the electroweak sector.

2:12:45

This is the first block which is the large mass difference. Case basically the beaner LSP case.

2:12:54

In this plot, basically see the, the existing limit from from LG and Atlas.

2:13:06

Hi Lumia let's see, full simulation I believe

2:13:12

projection. And then this has been scaled up to, to, to high energy.

2:13:19

Energy so this would be the high to me.

2:13:24

The high low method reaction. So, what I wanted to show this is what what this this evolution comes from so this is the extra paper, but it comes from so there's a few things to note here. The first thing to note that what is in the briefing book is this Africa of the black curve, that's the exclusion curve. The discovery curve is the blue one.

2:13:53

The second one thing you can notice at this section. The, the court actually ends at 500 gV. So, while in the, the briefing book this has just been extrapolated with a straight line. And the solid point is to, to look up here what it says that this is the. The said decay mode. And there is of course also the Higgs decay mode, and this looks like this. This is also from the same paper, and what you can notice that unlikely two plots are on completely different scales, but you can note that they reach at the very high mass difference this is actually higher for the, the Higgs mode but the reach in the domestic differences is weak and this I think Carlos already pointed out.

2:14:49

And the point why this is important note is illustrated here. So here, I basically show plots while I scan scan this parameter plane, and the only thing I do, between this for everything this plot, and this plot is to change, one of the relative signs. And as you can see red turns to Blue Blue fast red to completely invert whether the dominating decay mode is Hicks mode, or the sad mode.

2:15:26

So the conclusion from that is what, which one it is.

2:15:30

You can't actually tell. So it means up the exclusion region should really be the intersection of these two dots so so the worst possible case because you can't simply cannot tell which one of the two of you would expect.

2:15:45

So putting these things together, then I could sort of add this red line on on the, on to the plot and saying that the exclusion definite exclusion is only below this red line. And it's interesting to note that this is basically the line with slope one half the whether the LSP MLSP masters twice yet esteem us, which also means that in this region, you will not have get unification of m one and m two because the mass difference cannot be that big, if we would have a unification of The Beano and we know pyrometer.

2:16:30

Okay. Then, the, the other thing in, in, in the briefing book is on the, the no mascot films case, the we know the casino, and SP and here you have, have the CMS Atlas projections.

2:16:48

And so these are proxy. These are from the soft leptons search. And the reason why Atlas goes to smaller mass differences and then CMS is not because CMS are stupid that's because it's because their, their detector is different. So, the CMS kilometer has larger radius on the Atlas map one and it has a stronger v feed and to use this off lepton method, you have to know like have an F DME on this. To know that Kevin f left on your left mass reach 100 meter because otherwise you cannot know if it's new winner pay on.

2:17:26

So this is. So, this capital fear is sort of inevitable it's built into the detectors and actually impossible to know that this would be the more light at FCC Ah, you would be more on the CMS side because in in the tentative detector for FC HHS even larger than then CMS has an even stronger beefy injection of the capital in. In, leptin pts would be higher.

2:18:01

Now they are. So this is one thing. The other thing is this hatched band here at the bottom.

2:18:07

So, this is what comes from, from a beta, mainly from the disappearing tracks.

2:18:15

And these other plots from the FCC h h

2:18:21

conceptual design report Harrop point out that is that you really look at the gray bands, not, not the pink ones because the gray ones are or corresponds to detect which is actually presented in the cdr and the pink one so more than an exercise is fine What could you do with if you would build a innovated detector, with an innermost layer which is much much too close to survive the radiation

2:18:55

damage expected at FCC h h.

2:19:00

So you can see in the upper block that the windows. Here you see that this disappearing practice is clearly can be very powerful but for the Exynos. You see, This is, this case here, you do not reach failure 44 you do not reach discovery anywhere.

2:19:20

So this is also important to note. Now, the key element for the disappearing practice was what what the difference is. And hear from so the once again with our scan of the parameter space where what mass difference you actually would find between the chain on the in the in the scene or we're done all this different cover calories and so on this corresponds to different sushi paramita points.

2:19:52

And you can also see this line.

2:19:55

And this is basically the line that is this massive difference, pretty much fixed Maximus difference is the one that is used in in the conclusions shown on the previous slide. And the reason why why this line doesn't seem to be anything in particular here is that, that this is the masturbating you would get from only a standard model loop effects. And so basically in in the D Pixie no reason why, where m one and m two is much much bigger than the new so there is no mixing effect.

2:20:31

And here you have the similar block for for the V, we know the spatial area here. Once again you can see this is the. The calculate limit, which is, as you can see it's really a lower limit and.

2:20:47

And then this is of course important because see towel depends on what the difference is. And here you see, see a massive difference between zero and one gv for the Chino.

2:21:01

And, of course, when this is there. The, the vertical line is basically the pie on you and mass, where, where the lifetime, then it's a big jump. And if you then transform the depth, the depth and plots from the previous slide to sito for the, for the casino, then you see that this is in centimeters. So, so this is C tau one millimeter hundred micron, and so on. So you see that most of the points, have a seat

2:21:39

in the order of microns or 10s of microns, on the, on the vein, on the other hand it's much more favorable. You actually get to see towels or meters, in many cases, but there are still points where you're still down on the microliter level.

2:21:59

So the conclusion on this is that it's not an offshore in that lifetime will be long, large. And there's good chances for for the, for, for the winner but no guarantee and it's unlikely for the casino.

2:22:12

So, basically coming back to the cloth. This means, if you look at the values of delta m where, where

2:22:23

the disappearing practice will actually work them. See this is at one gv actually should be down here someone just above it. The red text.

2:22:32

Because, once the mask difference is bigger than that. The, the lifetime, simply becomes too too short. This is no criticism to the briefing book because this is clearly said in the text but if you see the blocked you might might think that it's the only gap is this more gap here but that's, that's just for descriptive purposes.

2:22:59

Okay, so, uh, so this is some sort of a summary plot of, of, of this one used to be in into the, the ILC relevant part of the plot so here is the, the MSP price. The LSP mass line, this is the, the, the, the Atlas projection when you're all worried between the Higgs and the sed mode, and the, the current limits from from Atlas from certain gv, and, and the ATV around, and the smallness difference

2:23:46

region.

2:23:48

From there the, the soft left analysis.

2:23:53

Okay, so, so this is just to tell you that you can see that quite a lot of interesting parameter space is. Therefore, the plus minus equalizer and, and it's, and in the region here over the small to average mass differences, it's not obvious at high low mobility will will will contribute Very much so.

2:24:23

So this was just to make this say that there's no reason to despair. For associate at the ANC.

2:24:32

And now I'm gonna tribute have a picture gallery of what has already been done at sushi another first thing I would show is that I care plus minus and general exclusion and discover is basically the same, same thing, an exclusion is exclusion, it means that there are new posts and, and consequently that assumes search is pretty much the same thing as the Susi measurement. You can do model testing, and you know sound effects mentally so CFP is here it's more like doing physics at the factory than doing Susi active at p p collider

2:25:16

side of exclusion equals discovery, this is just a plot I did for fun some time time ago where I basically do nothing but asked for low multiplicity events with basically no no smart selections and the green areas, you see here, this is this is this electron.

2:25:41

So, without the calories. If something happens that the clear edge here is sort of like you know avoidable no sophisticated analysts analysis. And if you do a bit more theory to try to select the electrons. This is what the signal looks like after five inverse tempt Ivana of data which is about one week of data taking. So basically, the, the discovery of sushi if it's if it's there, you pretty much do it by looking at FPL online monitoring histograms.

2:26:23

And then, so these are actually blocked from, from the previous Snowmass where you, you show the exclusion and discovery in for in the case of a probably easiest case with new one and LSP, and what you should notice if there are two curves here, the red one is exclusion the black one is discoveries so this is this difference between these two is much smaller than them, the width of the lines, shown in the for the various you plus or minus machines in the briefing book, and even for Star Wars. The problem, possibly most difficult one, see that the difference between, between exclusion and discovery is pretty minimal.

2:27:16

And another, another case with a trucking and LSP after mass give them less than three gv and here you can see the, the five sigma, and the two sigma, or exceed no exceed or like, we know like under 5050 mix of them and once again you'll see that you go to the two sigma, and two there, the five sigma on any of the lines, you can see how many gv that is.

2:27:46

So basically, exclusion is equals discovery at any plus or minus machine.

2:27:54

Furthermore, but you can you can pretty immediately say that sushi sushi is seussian. So here's a scan of the electron threshold. And so with 10 inverse femto bonds about two weeks of rounding per point and this is probably an overkill to have 10 points but, nevertheless, for around the, the Select drum, and likewise for this new one. And the two curves you see the red curve, and the dotted curve this is seeing whether this rise is, is ghost with a b2b cube. And it's absolutely completely excluded that it goes with beta. And so it's clear that that this is produced in in the P wave not an S wave and that the fuse board exam for all scalars.

2:28:53

Okay.

2:28:55

And then, now with more data than you can start measuring properties so this is the same, select Run analysis but now with a one year of of data, and then you can pretty much. Imagine how well you can miss where the, where the edges of this distribution is and from that extract the only two irrelevant parameters which is the LSP and the and the name. The select from us. And you can do that also for the spouse gets a bit more tricky because out here you can only be one measurement for the apple endpoint. This crossover here because the lower endpoint is disappears in the in huge necessary selection counts. After whether it's more or less, as I do today.

2:29:46

Obviously, then for the decay of the towel.

2:29:50

You can look at similar things for a Chino model. This one I like because this blue thing here that looks like a, like an arrow in the clothing is actually not an error it's part of the fit because this is a gate jPi. So there's a Chino

2:30:15

police actually neutralino decaying into a, a jPi and under native speed.

2:30:24

And typically we find that with the, with a few years of running you typically are are determining Susie Massey said to 100 entities at the personal level.

2:30:42

And this you can measure, measure this all in tough cases here is a case where we'll say, a sortino neutralino case where in this case, the mass difference is 1.6 gV only and you can see there, you just gonna have a sub percent measurement on on by this. The mouse here, that you expect from the endpoint. And here, even worse, here you go down to 770 MEP and steel sub assembly level measurement of the, of the mass.

2:31:14

swathmore Yeah So you not only can you measure, measure mass message we can also measure more complex things so here is a another analysis style production, where the, the polarization of the, the tower from the style decay was analyzed by looking at the, the dedication, General The, the pay goes to road neutrino, and with this optimal observable of the energy of the charge pi n divided by the total energy. So the energy of the, the pi plus pi zero, you get a very strong dependence on on on the polarization as you can see, the polarization of the tower could be determined to about 5%, and this gives you more modern just direct handle on on the style mixing angle.

2:32:11

And you can do even more here you really come into the, the beef factory situation so you would actually have Cascada case over stepped on so suppose you have a modern way Haven't you fully know to go into kept on kept on kept on slept on neutralino in, in this decay chain less enough constraints do a full kinematic reflection on you can actually get a stepped on signal that is not just an edge or something like that it's really a peak and.

2:32:48

And you can zoom in on the peak and you can see that you can fit the sigma of the fitted Gaussian here is a DMV and that's about hundred events in the peak so you'll have would have 10 MEP uncertainty of the mass in this case. And you could do the same for the status note as well but you can still get a style peak, rather than just a, an endpoint in, in, in a spectrum. Of course, depends on on this.

2:33:20

Guess JDK actually exists.

2:33:25

What can can

2:33:29

do. Furthermore, with the in this analysis, basically, I've measured. Only the hexene or properties basically they're usually in a one neutralino two, and the Chino cross sections masses polarized cross sections.

2:33:49

And if you take this plus the expected positions from the, the Higgs measurements that I'll see and put this into 10 parameter MSM feet run on an mC mC.

2:34:06

You can also get predictions on all the other massive so they're heavier heavier chinos heavy, heavy exists as Follow me on this Follow me on this and that, the, the, the glue, you know.

2:34:24

And you can also cast models once again this is another hc SR model and this is actually the one where this extremely small massive differences.

2:34:36

So, here with only those three particles produced.

2:34:44

You can you tell me the allowed range for for m one and m two and actually in. In this model, the can actually get both upper and lower limits for both their m one and m two and in the other model, you have an upper and lower limit for for m two and a lower limit for m one but no, no upper limit on one.

2:35:09

Or I can also

2:35:16

use this to run the, the RGS up to the, the, the highest scale, and see if we see an indication of unification of.

2:35:30

m one m two. So this is one of the the models so there we have a good measurement of m one m two, and only some

2:35:42

rough estimate of what m three could could be. And you indeed see that the reason why they cross over is somewhere in around the gap scale so the m one m two very nicely

2:35:56

comes together here, and the M three estimate doesn't contradict that. And once you do that you can say okay then I turn this around and assume that M three is actually unifying with m one m two M and you run the RG in the other direction. And then you can predict predict what the M three should be basically if you eat donuts should be okay so I think this was the fuller picture gallery.

2:36:29

So I come to the conclusion some and.

2:36:33

So, I wanted to point out the difference between discovery potential and exclusion potential.

2:36:45

Whether you can discover some model or model some future future and current PP machines have discovered a potential to very high masses. But if I might put it bluntly that basically have no fusion potential. There will always be loopholes.

2:37:07

But on the other in the future TVs candy plus or minus machine would have full discovery and exclusive potential up to the kinematic limit.

2:37:17

And then, like to finish with some ideas of input to Snowmass so in this case for, for automatic conserving it is sim wants to say that most IDs exists on the boat, usually done with full simulation for detector simulation. So, in this case, it isn't much into to be added for for Snowmass This is basically a literature study.

2:37:47

But there are obviously other things to do.

2:37:51

So little as as be done for alternative eating sushi.

2:37:56

Not much has been done for extension to NSM so NSM gauge mediated sushi breaking for instance squawks basically says okay squawks is off balance three plus minus. Everything will be done with the VP machines but my theory. Maybe there are extra holes since for Calgary's form hide. I do may let's see. So, this is a

2:38:27

interesting subject that has not been studied.

2:38:31

So also lonely particles it's a bit the same story, because it's obvious that if you have long lived politics in particularly detector stable charged particles that is an equal c minus machine as is no match for the BP, but on the other end in the other direction with the shorter lifetimes.

2:38:53

This probably the E plus minus machine has has an edge that you can get for instance we had in in this lowest mask difference Hicks ino scenario, the one is 770 and maybe a mess difference there.

2:39:15

The, the impact parameters of the MDK products was actually useful for, for separating the signal from background.

2:39:27

And, and who was in in new theory ideas. And in a theoretician who likes to play around come take as an input from the ANC.

2:39:40

You can expect masses to be measured as a sub percent level cross sections, and also polarized cross sections, could be measured to the present level as soon as to be the, the particle can be produced. And as I said this is basically true as soon as it is in at all in kinematic reach.

2:40:06

Okay, so this was one I think yes yeah okay take home message.

2:40:13

So, without TVs can let them collide would not be able to exclude sushi farther than then today at the end of the century.

2:40:24

Except of course if a PP machine would discover Susannah Madison was a property we would like to have.

2:40:32

Okay, thank you.

2:40:37

Thank you very much.

2:40:40

So, we have questions, but before we go there, what is right now, the status of some first of all guest candy. that would be fantastic we had an IOC especially for looking for, you know, there could be except there the Suzy.

2:40:55

But what is, what is the current status or is I, I'm perpetually confused about. Yes. So, I think that as of the release of the European strategy. Last week, the, I would say let's say situation is unusually bright.

2:41:18

So basically what happens on the Japanese side is that the, the interest for the ANC has moved up from the, the Ministry of Education Technology, etc. The next to really to the cabinet.

2:41:38

And there is

2:41:44

clear, clear push.

2:41:48

We are being told that we are allowed to, to talk about energy upgrades. So before we should always say, not more than 250 because it gets too too expensive but now, apparently. When, when, the, the thing has moved up to an AI higher level the longevity, the longevity of the project becomes more important and, and the Japanese politicians are very interested to see what the upgrade plans are.

2:42:22

So that is one thing. And the other thing is, is the European strategy which.

2:42:28

Now, clearly state that the IMC is a project which is very much in line of what the, the other things mentioned in in the in the strategy.

2:42:45

So, sir basically seems seems no contradiction with, with it and there's also a number of measurements and measures about how.

2:42:57

So on you report contribute.

2:43:00

That's sort of a important points that someone says that they would be ready and formally able to be a partner, which is very important for the smaller European countries. So, Germany or France or, or whether UK you can go in with sufficient weight to, to have an impact but was Portugal Sweden would be, say if this is bilateral. We wouldn't be completely.

2:43:36

We would completely disappear so for the smaller member states have so it's very important to tell themselves that they will would participate so. So I think this is.

2:43:50

Yeah, I mean things are or are moving pretty fast. Now, so it's really, it seems like the, the, the Japanese political sphere is getting more and more interested.

2:44:07

We also hear it here are words from the US that mean encouraging words, not only from the UAE but from the State Department and now adding the, the European strategy which is now. I mean, this is the European strategy it's been signed off this is for Europe is going to do for the next six or seven years.

2:44:29

Yeah, looks unusually bright.

2:44:33

Okay, so fingers crossed. All right. Um, so let's see, Sam has his hand raised. So, yeah, I, um, I had a Navy quick and technical one about slide 12, where you show a bunch of different populations and the plane of the delta m, and

2:44:55

takes time to get to 12.

2:44:58

Okay. Right. Yes, well so I guess I understand that the black line represents like pure radiative corrections. Yes, but as I said, only the Standard Model loop corrections to the, the mass splitting. So this is basically applicable in the case that you have a have to this is mixing okay so you have a, a new mew and m one and m two is much much bigger. Right. And, yeah, so So my question is, maybe you can comment on the set of points that are below the line. Yes, both, both you know between zero and the line, and less than zero. Yeah.

2:45:42

That's. Yes. So, this is interesting and and so as I actually pointed out didn't say it but but it's just in the text that as you can see that there's actually have negative density and which then implies a fit. It's actually the Chino that is the lightest sparkle, which is, of course, was basically excluded from, from cosmology acceptive or parities is is violated.

2:46:08

And, yeah, I mean I don't actually know why, why you seem to have this sort of. I mean, there is no motion not the density of points should have absolutely no importance in. In this plot. So this is really a scan in, in, in a box of points. So, so I could be an accident but there happens to be very few points in in the region, just below the line.

2:46:40

And yes, the region below the line and above zero is, is that an interesting theoretical region, isn't it easier to give more delta m and take away delta m.

2:46:52

Yeah, I mean, the this. I really have to check the, the, the California but the open symbols, they, they indicate that these are cases where.

2:47:09

So mew is smallest tr m two is is larger than, it's more than an M one.

2:47:19

So,

2:47:23

and.

2:47:26

Yeah.

2:47:27

Can I Can I add something yeah I'm sure that that's been wants to add something because we've been discussing quite a lot about about this so these could Yes, exactly.

2:47:39

This is, this is fino and swim will not help us what what what find Hicks says about this. No no no. Well, okay.

2:47:50

When I saw this foot for the first time at the same question that Sam just had. And this ended up in the discussion between Nikkei vana Paul what the author of theano and myself, but I think this discussion never really came to full conclusion. No one just takes the math matrices and diagonalize them then one never by construction gets that the Trevino is lighter than the. And then the lightest neutralino. This is comes from radiative corrections going somewhere from the DIA Obama's on Seamus, but I don't think it's guaranteed that this is done, 100% correctly, and I think it is not. I don't think that even with ionic corrections you would arrive to this kind of situation. And therefore, whether one is whether one has

2:48:43

point 1.2 point three gv difference here. I think this is still subject to debate so I wouldn't interpret too much into small changes in these points I think that all points below zero would move up, if this was done correctly. Yeah, I fully agree and it's not so much the point of this I mean I'm.

2:49:04

I'm.

2:49:06

I am wanting to stress the fact that there are plenty of points when the above the line so these are this. So, of course, these guys down here would be things basically becoming more or less detector stable, but it's the thing.

2:49:22

I'm sure they would move up and change Yeah, that's the phenomenology. Yeah.

2:49:28

There are old plots from Howie haber and others that showed regions of charging or at tree level charging or being the LSP.

2:49:42

In the lower new region.

2:49:45

From far back for negative news.

2:49:49

If you could curry I would be curious because I also work a lot on these parameters and this this I've never seen, but we came back in the 80s and 90s now but the moss matrices haven't changed. So, No, they haven't but saying these are for masses that were pre left. Okay, maybe I have never heard there are choices. This can be, but please send me a reference I would be curious to take a look. We had to look at these points. We'll find Hicks, It seems that the prominence for onshore values whereas fino assumes that the idea bar values and find Hicks arrives at only positive mass differences. Whereas, C no gives you this but I said I think this is because of some incorrectly applied high order connections.

2:50:48

Okay.

2:50:50

So they any other no more questions I don't see any other hands race. Um, so we've already gone way over our scheduled time but I for one really enjoyed this session, and thank you very much for all our speakers and also for our participants I think this was good. And I see also that people were interacting on slack and I would really encourage you to keep doing that because the whole point of that is that you don't have, you know, you can go and come back and type stuff to people, etc.

2:51:24

Anyway, so, and also just a reminder again that we will have our.

2:51:29

The workshop, the main workshop coming up in a few weeks. And then we have the topical group meetings, like the parallel sessions of the work of what would have been in the regular workshop we've scheduled them. A week before.

2:51:45

I would recommend you know people who have interest to submit abstracts to that.

2:51:51

And hopefully we will see you guys then. To write, right. Thank you.

2:52:00

All right.

2:52:03

Thank you.

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